Well, I've had my CWP for a few weeks now, and I finally got sick of not having an IWB holster. I don't really know exactly what I want, so I decided to just go with a cheap Uncle Mike's until I figure out what I want to spend some real money on.
My wife was at work, and then is working a shift at the fire station afterward, so I was alone for the day and evening. After getting my sleep for the day (I work nights) I decided to just run up to Cabella's 20 miles away, and pick up a holster.
While I was at it, I figured I'd get at least 1 XD-40 subcompact magazine, so that I can finally do the "grip chop" to my 'Service Model' XD. And, what the hell, while I'm spending money, I've been wanting to go to ceramic beads for my brass tumbler.
My brother texted me, and asked me to come help him look over the motorcycle that he's rebuilding, and make a list of what parts it still needed. I told him that I was going to run up to Cabella's first, and that he was welcome to come along. "I've never been there," he said, "I s'pose I'll tag along". I run a few blocks down the road and pick him up.
We travel the 20 miles or so, up to Alpine. After driving past the 2 entire rows of handicap parking, and remarking at how ridicules it is to waste that much parking that would NEVER be used at that store, we saunter inside, making small-talk and searching for the object of my desire--a Uncle Mikes Size #15 Sidekick IWB Holster.
Now, I can't ever really figure out the layout of this place... They have the store laid out in sections--Guns, Gun Accessories, Clothing, Boats, Fishing, etc. But within each section, there doesn't really seem to be any logic to any of it. Each isle seems to have a little bit of everything in it. So you have to check each isle.
Isle 1 has about 5 holsters, "Blackhawks, and a couple of Galcos. Next to them, we have a Coyote Calls, Paintballs, Shoelaces, .50 BMG reloading dies, and Trail Mix... Alright, lets try isle 2."
"...more Galcos, and some Uncle Mike's, but these ones appear to be only the Kydex ones... Next to them, we have .40 S&W reloading dies, a rifle sling, Glock Magazines, wool socks, Sig Sauer Night Sites... Hmmm, lets try the NEXT isle".
The next isle has another random assortment of products... "Hmm, .22 lr ammo, 30-06 reloading dies, ah, here's a couple holsters..."
So about 3 min. into this little Yard-sale experience, up walks a guy in a tan shirt. He says "I'm _____ [Didn't catch the name] with Cabella's Asset Protection [meaning he's supposed to watch out for shoplifters] and you need to either take your gun back to your truck, or conceal it. Utah doesn't have an Open Carry Law."
I guess he doesn't realize that being that this is a free country, I don't need a law to tell me something's legal. Under our legal system, something's 'legal', unless it's 'illegal'.
Well, I'm a little taken aback. First of all, I find it incredibly odd that the first time ANYBODY has a problem with my gun, in over a year of open-carrying, it's at a Cabella's, of all places! And it's incredibly ironic that it just so happens to be when I'm trying to purchase a concealment holster!
He continues on, "...or give me the gun, and I'll lock it up..." At this point, I've heard enough. I don't feel like wasting my time explaining how, or why it's legal, to some drone who makes $8 an hour, who needs to feel important by telling me his views of the law.
"Okay, we'll leave," I say. "Okay, thank you," he replies. And then we leave.
I have no problem spending my money on the internet, and it seems that this is the thanks I get for making an effort to spend my money locally. It doesn't matter to me if they don't want my money, but I'm kinda hacked I burned the gas to go up there.
I'm going to be writing a letter to Cabella's Corporate Offices, and relaying my experience to them. I don't know if this is business as usual, but if it is, I will never set foot in Cabella's again.
So after we drive back and check little bro's bike over, we decide to go rent a movie. I have a Blockbuster Pass, so I take a movie back to exchange. Decided on Charlie Wilson's War (which is pretty good, BTW).
In the back of my mind, I'm still slightly self-conscious of the gun on my hip, even though I've carried in this store many times. I walk up to the counter, and hand over the movies. The guy at the counter smiles and says, "whatcha carrying there?" "Oh crap," I think, but reply, "It's a Springfield XD40." "Subcompact?", he asks. "Nope, it's a service model, but I'm going to do the 'grip chop' so it will have the shorter grip like the Subcompact". "Cool," he says, "you have a CWP?" "Yup." "Me too, I just got mine. I carry a Subcompact XD-40." "Cool"!
And I'd always heard that Blockbuster was uptight about guns...
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I'm a CWP trainer and long time supporter of carry laws. Furthermore, i've had my share od arguments with Cabela's.
ReplyDeleteMy freind, they had other people in the store. It's their store, and they felt it wasn't appropriate behavior. They didn't wan't to bother explaining to the rest of their customers just what it was you were doing.
Mr. $8.00 an hour evidentally wanted to keep his job, and it seems they gave you several choices.
Any good holster brand lists the models it fits best. Heck, try finding an IWB for a Kimber Ultra Carry.
Go to a forum like USCCA or The Firing Line & post a question. You'll get a hundred answers.
BTW. If I had my family in there, I'd have said something about your actions. CWP holders should be ambassadors of proper behavior with a firearm.
Regards.
Hmmmmm, I love the quality Cabellas handles but I have also found some of the chesty flexers, who work in Cabellas, to be rather obnoxious at times. Most of the rest are terrific people. Is that just an example of human nature in almost any business? I hope so because I planned not to return to Cabellas a few months ago but then began to examine the store philosohy and that one or two employees were having a bad day because they were just making $8/hr and felt they were worth more.
ReplyDeleteI have elected to try to keep a low profile and allow myself to be handled a little more than I like when I am in someone else's store.
Don't like it but as an old friend once said: Don't cut your nose off to spite your face.
Keep smilin and have a good day...
The operative word in CWP is CONCEALED! Keep your gun CONCEALED. I shop at a local Cabelas and do carry, I have never had a problem becaused no one knew I had a gun other than a couple of friends who work there. As a 30 year L/E Officer I would have given you a hard look bacause of your open carry and you would have a hard time finding someone more "pro gun" than me. Legal or not, you are just looking for a problem (and looking like a fool). Ever hear of a mall shooting? Stores and society are a little sensitive about seeing people with a gun in public.
ReplyDeleteIf something were to happen, are you trained to properly act? I very much doubt it. Just be a good witness and keep the gun concealed.
That 8 dollar an hour worker is trying to make ends meet just like the rest of us. And keep in mind that if you dont do your job at any Cabelas, you are gone, no ands, ifs or buts, just fired.
Re Anonymous of October 29, 2008 7:10 AM: As someone also "in law enforcement" (23 years) I think that the tone some police officers use when addressing the public does them more harm than good.
ReplyDeleteYou are entitled to your opinion about why people may carry openly, but your status as a law enforcment officer does not give you special insight any more than driving a patrol unit makes you an automotive designer. I live in ranching country, and everyone who carries here carries openly for the simple reason that it is much more comfortable on a fenceline or a horse. And, believe me, these men and women have no need to prove anything to anyone.
Also, your comment "take it from the professionals" also leaves me cold. Police officers are not professional gunmen, and in my experience most have adequat but not extraordinary expertise in that area. That's not a snipe, just a recognition of the fact that the firearm is only one tool in an officer's job, and a rather limited one at that. A true "professional" would recognize that how one carries depends - as the real professionals at, say, Fort Benning would say - on the terrain and the situation.
Again, I'm not picking on you here, but if you are going to evoke your status as a law enforcer, be cognizant of the fact that your words will color that status whether you want them to or not.
I do'nt carry all of the time, only when I feel I need to. VA has a concealed carry law, I do'nt subscribe(too much scrutiny!) When I carry, it's well concealed. If I feel that I have to use it, I'll use it, not threaten, and certainly not "flash it around".
ReplyDeleteIf I ever feel the need to carry into a store, or wherever, I just declare it and ask permission, like a big boy. Haven't had too many issues.
If you show up, unannounced like that in my store, I'm not sure I'm going to be so courteous. Quite swinging your johnson(small j) around and don't give the anti's any more ammunition!
PS I hunt and shoot all the time and have been a member on numerous pistol, rifle and shotgun teams for over 35 years
Hey check it out im working in az and sitting in waterbuger for lunch.i always like to sit faceing the door and in walks a guy carring on his hip and another and another but what is funny to all of your comments i didnt se any one hit the ground are start screaming are running are freaking out they have an open policey nd their dosent seem to be a prob. now back to the concealed part when prision inmates were intervied they said crim does drop because they dont know who has a gun and who dosent
ReplyDeleteIt's not only Cabella. I have a CCW and was at Bass Pro shop on International Drive in Orlando to purchase the XDW 40. I went through all the paperwork of the purchase and they put it in a bag for me. Mind you, it's still in the case, in the box, and now in the bag. "I'm sorry sir, I can't give you the gun in the store. I'll walk you to the door and give it to you there." Strange that I walked in with a gun in my waist band and nothing was said. So, I bought a gun and got kicked out. I wasn't finished shopping either. They had the balls to say that I couldn't shop at any of the other stores in the mall area either. That was the last time I'll shop for ANYTHING at Bass Pro.
ReplyDeleteDon't be so naive, the thugs get the guns whether they are banned or not. The average citizen should be able to carry a weapon to protect themselves and their family. It is a know fact that communities with the most guns per capita have a lower crime rate. I guess the thugs don't like it if citizens can take up for themselves.
ReplyDeleteI've carried concealed for 35 years or so. I carry a compact in 40 S&W caliber loaded with the nastiest rounds available. If I ever have to use it I want the problem ended as quickly as possible. On the same note, only my closest friends know I carry. If it is ever necessary for my to pull it from its nesting place I want the full element of surprise along with anything else I can get in my favor. I live in an open carry state, but except for a backup in deer season I never use that option.
ReplyDeleteJust my opinion.
CCW is a good law, you should respect that. Its arrogant behavior that will ruin things for all. Any State that allows a person to carry CCW is a good American State.
ReplyDeleteyou write very well, very descriptive. good job
ReplyDeleteI had a similar issue at TGI Friday's a couple of weeks ago. I live in Virginia, so I am required to open carry in a restaurant that serves alcohol.
ReplyDeleteAnyways, AFTER waiting 30 minutes for a table, the manager asks me to put the gun in the car.
I simply told him I would rather eat elsewhere.
By the way, Virginia is similar with regards to open carry. It is legal because it is not illegal.
Take care.
Austin,
ReplyDeleteI feel your frustration as it is obvious you are a law abiding man. As of cop for 14 years in an urban environment, I've never had to respond to a call of a subject that was lawfully and rightfully open carrying a firearm. You would be the type of guy to back a cop. Thank you for that because a cop could one day use your help. It's the gang banging felony mopes that carry illegally and conceal their carry under a puffy coat or a 10X hoodie sweatshirt that are the beginning to the end of our society as we once knew it. My state (Indiana) won't let you buy booze on Sundays or holidays yet civilians can open or conceal carry (with a gun permit) 24/7. Oddly enough, my department does not allow us to open carry even with a badge and handcuffs in plain view whether on or off duty. We have to be in full uniform to open carry. Nuff said. Continue to exercise your constitutional rights. Be safe.
BARNEY WAS HAVING A BAD DAY.HE ONLY RAN YOU OUT CAUSE HE WAS JEALOUS.
ReplyDeleteKicked out of Cabellas...the main thing is, IMHO, you handled this very very well. By saying "ok we'll leave." and doing so, was good for all of us who carry a weapon. Good job.
ReplyDeleteNow for me! After 22 years as a police officer here in the city, let me make you feel a bit better.
I have had several situations over the years with people like this telling me to get out of the store cause they can see my GUN. Of course my BIG FREAKIN SLCPD BADGE was on the belt in front of and on the gun! In the summer it was the worst, I'd were tee shirt and a light dress shirt , untucked over the badge and gun. But sometimes in a place like Cabellas you don't realize your over shirt is pulled left. Yea can you believe that! Once at Pennys security come up, three of them, and asks if I would leave the store. This is recently. I immediately glance down, shirt is crumpled. One guy has his hand on his gun. I say I am a cop, you see the badge! The lead dork says,"still that family over there is upset." I'm boiling now. I say "Ok, but before I go are you done with your witness statement from last month, on that big 300 pound shoplifter I had to come arrest for you?" {he was gonna call me when finished, never did.} He turns red, and says oh yea now I remember you,I just cut him off and said "Well just get it over to investigations, and I'll get out now! I walk out with them saying something. So I guess I'm just saying you did well, I have had to walk off like that several times. Good control by you.
Anonymous said...
ReplyDelete...There are too many nuts with guns in this country, and for all the the $8/hr guy knew, you were one of them. Ban all handguns and this is never a problem!...
Came across this post while looking up Cabella's and just had to respond to the above comment I found posted. What a genius this guy is!!! I'm thinking let's take it a step farther and ban things like robbery and murder!!! That way we won't have to worry about the guns cause it would be illegal for someone to commit a crime with them!!! Moron.
Okay, done venting, as to the issue at hand, like several others who responded, I'm retired law enforcement...last 15 years as an elected County Sheriff and as such charged with issuing concealed carry permits which was actually one of the more rewarding parts of the job. As to open carry, allowed in Nevada as well, I'd rethink it if I were you but it's your right and your choice. And as Will Rogers said about guns..."better to have one and not need it than need one and not have it."
I am a grandmother that has no interest in people who feel so mighty and insecure they need to carry a gun in public. I took my grandson to Cabella's just to see the animals and the aquarium. If I had run across you I probably would have run screaming to security. What a babyfied attitude you have. Grow up!
ReplyDeleteWhy do you need the weapon to buy a "cheap" holster. Most are clearly mark what weapon they are used for, why not read the labels?? Openly carrying a weapons makes a lost of people uncomfortable when they see you with a weapon on your hip. Using some common sense (which I think you do have) would make a lot more sense and whould give cause gun banners less "ammo". The $8.00 am hour man was doing his job. You should respect at least that fact.
ReplyDeleteLarger stores have policies concerning open carry of weapons. Perhaps you should do a little home work about the store you plan to visit while using open carry of your pistol. Don't put down the $8.00 an hour man, he is trying to make a living and was following the store's policy concerning pistol with opon carry. There have been far too many store and mall shootings for most people to be comfortable seeing someone with a weapon on their hip. Be considerate of others and you will not be asked to leave another store.
ReplyDeleteI have been an Indiana State Trooper, Crime scene investigator, and a Burns Harbor police officer.
ReplyDeleteI understand about people that feel "uneasy". I see stuff all the time that makes me uneasy but the guvmint says its ok. If it is not illegal, they tell me just don't look. SO I don't look.
I conceal my weapon too, but only because I don't need the grief. But, I am so sick of my rights being taken, changed, and modified because some grandma gets upset. Where will it end? It won't!
Hey Grandma, I have seven grandkids of my own and I know this, Cabela's is a place for guns, ammo, and it is full of all kinds of animals that have been shot and stuffed. If seeing guns offends you, take your grandkids to an art museum or a ballet, you won't see any guns there.
To those of you who've asked [and apparently can't read] I was going into the store TO BUY A CONCEALED HOLSTER. The whole reason I got a CWP was so that I COULD conceal. I just didn't have the holster for it.
ReplyDeleteThe holster I was going for was a simple Uncle Mike's neoprene IWB holster, which do NOT state what weapons they are for. Just sizes in a numerical system from 1-?.
I wasn't carrying to feel tough, I was carrying because, what's the point of having a CWP and a gun, if you're not going to carry?
I carry a gun, because they don't make a holster big enough to carry cops.
I'd feel really freaking stupid if I went into Cabella's to buy a Concealment holster, and somebody decided to come in and shoot the place up.
A gun on the hip, is worth a 10 in the car.
Grandma, I've carried virtually every single day since I got that holster (at Sportsman's Warehouse), and my gun hasn't killed anybody yet. So run and scream all you want. Seems like 'running and screaming' is the only option you've allowed yourself. Hope you put the grandkids' running shoes on, before you take 'em out...
[QUOTE]Steve said...
ReplyDeleteI'm a CWP trainer ..................
BTW. If I had my family in there, I'd have said something about your actions.
Regards.[/QUOTE]
Help me out with what seems to be a pattern of CWP instructors wanting to push confrontations. So, Steve, if your family WASN'T with you, you wouldn't have felt the need to butt into something that is none of your business, whereas if your family WAS there, you would feel the need to pound your chest? You should spend a few bucks on counseling before you get yourself or your family injured.
Remember, discretion is the better part of valor.
PS. If your weapon truely is for concealemnt, why do you feel the need to tell us brand/model? Oh, that's right, we're back to the chest pounding again.
I can understand the irritablity that you felt,alot of stores has changed their security policy's.Not that I blame them with todays crimes.It's better to be safe than sorry.I'm a woman and i can certainly understand the need to take the handgun in with you to fit the holster to the gun and you,not tall holsters fit what they say they will and if it does;DOES IT FIT YOU? Nine times out of ten;NOPE.But i have found that if you stop at the courtsey desk,and tell them what your looking for,(and have firearm with you)they will assist you,and that way the preverbial hysterical lady does'nt run through the store screaming the crazy man has a gun,lmao(Just had a mental flash of that.
ReplyDeleteLittle Brother,
ReplyDeleteHow does my telling you the make and model of weapon I own, make it any less "concealed"? I'm not walking around telling everybody "I own an XD-40 Service Model, and an Uncle Mikes Size #15 IWB Soft Holster, with Speer +P+ Gold Dot 185gr rounds."
When it's on me, it's generally in a holster, tucked inside my waste band. When people ask me if I'm carrying, my usual answer is, "If I told you, I'd have to kill you.", with a wink and a smile.
The weapon is for SELF defense. Whether concealed or not has no bearing on the purpose of the weapon.
To Anonymous,
I understand what you're saying, but my belief is that the place for a weapon is in a holster. I would be MUCH more freaked out by someone walking through the front door with a gun in their HAND than a gun on their hip.
Guns in holsters don't shoot people. ;)
I think grandma would have a change of heart if she watched a gang banger gun down her grandson for her purse. When you have law bidding citizens carrying weapons it is a deterrent to crime. To carry a firearm is a right!! I do not tell you what church or god you must worship. I may not believe as you do but I respect your rights. Please respect ours!
ReplyDeletesorry to hear you had such a crappy experience.
ReplyDeleteHOWEVER! I really like all of those handicapped parking spaces at Cabella's, and lots of other disabled athletes and "outdoor enthusiasts" do too.
http://www1.va.gov/vetevent/wsc/2008/
There's a lot of us who sacrificed our health, body parts, and even more to make sure you are free to wrongfully believe that disabled folks couldn't possibly want to park at Cabella's.
http://www.paralympic.org/
Even disabled civvies can find lots of very useful things at Cabella's.
Just because we use canes / crutches / chairs doesn't mean we stay inside 24/7. YUCK! Try thinking before you type!
PART TWO:
ReplyDeleteif you're thinking that sporting gear is only a narrow portion of Cabela's line up, try dropping by the nearest VA hospital and just start asking all of the vets if there are any who love to go hunting / fishing / camping / etc.
you might want to buckle up your chin strap first ... to prevent your jaw from getting bruised when it bounces on the floor.
Fishing? Can you explain to us how you think it would be impossible for someone who normally sits on a seat attached to wheels would NOT be able to sit on a seat attached to a boat?
Camping? There might only be a few out braving the back country, but I assure you -- we love "car camping" as much as the next person!
Hunting? I assure you, in the military, firing a weapon from a square stance is actually pretty dang rare! That's why we have to practice firing from many different body positions.
Chew on some knowledge. It tastes better than feet.
Anonymous, You've totally taken what I said, out of context.
ReplyDeleteI didn't say that there was no use for handicapped parking. But if you've actually been to the Cabella's in question, you'd know that there is WAY too much discriminatory parking reserved.
I realize that there are plenty of disabled folks who enjoy the store. But a good deal of it is wasted parking. The handicapped parking has NEVER been full, that I've seen. Though there has been a couple of times that I've seen, where even the over-flow parking for us mere bi-peds, was full to capacity, while 20 perfectly good parking spots were being wasted by being reserved for a demographic that remained a no-show.
Think about how many more handicapped people go to wal-mart, and then compare the parking lots.
I have no problem with handicapped parking (though there aren't any laws that prevent you from parking in any regular parking spots either). This case is just a bit excessive. That is all.
Two things; 1) Businesses have to put in a certain percentage of parking as handicapped. I think it is 10% of total. Regardless of consumer demographics. 2) I am so tired of hearing "As a LE I would"...If you are not on duty and someone is not breaking the law your status as LE should be kept to yourself. It's using the threat of power behind the badge to intimidate. And that's a shame because most of the LE I know are great folks and would take a bullet to save a civvie. BUT there's always one who thinks he has to tell you he's LE. 3) Face it the guy handled it right by leaving and not causing a scene. Anything else would be blown out of proportion and possibly used as more propoganda to erode our 2nd amendment rights. We must police ourselves or we will become our own worst enemy. I would recommend talking to the clerks boss and ask him what the policies are. Not to get the guy fired but just to make sure the store policy really is as stated.
ReplyDeleteBlame the no. of handicap parking spaces on the city you're in, not at the store you are at. And your permit to carry CONCEALED means just that. You're lucky you weren't in Texas and spotted by a cop.
ReplyDeleteHow do you guys know that guy makes 8 bucks an hour? that is all.
ReplyDeleteLOL
I have been shooting and reloading on and off since I was 10, an NRA member, and gun club member so certainly no anti-gun evangilist. But I have to wonder why in a relatively safe place like Utah or Colorado, so many people want or need CWPs, and especially why they would be upset for someone on private property asking an arms carrying individual to leave. If you lived in some ghetto, or are ALWAYS carrying large amounts of cash or jewels, I could understand that. But really, after all the mass shootings by the nuts out there, people must be idiots or incredibly self centered and paranoid to wonder why all the other peaceful people shopping around them might get nervous and want to leave when they see some stranger carrying a gun. Even at guns stores, there are rules about entering with a gun!!!
ReplyDeleteIn addition, just because someone is an officer of the law doesn't mean they should be treated special when they are off duty. If a cop on duty here in Calif. sees a person walking into a store with a gun, he will likely draw and have that guy down on the ground, either dead or alive, period.
But some guys need to show their thing off to feel like they are special or real men, and maybe that is the case here. I wonder if after aquiring a concealable holster, the original poster keeps it a secret, or brags to everyone he encounters that he's got a CWP. Sounds like a ego power trip or obsessive paranoid to me. Scary in any case, and I suppose that's the point!
The idea of a citizen using a legally carried weapon to shoot someone in order to stop a crime in progress might sound good and has a romantic old West quality to it, but it will definitely land the "good samaritan" in jail, possible up on 2nd degree murder charges. (Unless they are a cop. Let's face it, cops can shoot people almost anytime they want and get away with it, unless they're caught on video like the fool in Oakland Ca. on 1/1/09.) So saying that you want a CWP to that you can stop a nut in a sporting goods store or any other public situation is just plain fantasy. Also, when the cops arrive, you'd better be far away from your handgun or they'll ventilate your well intentioned a**! After being victimized repeatedly, police told me I could only shoot the aggressor if he was INSIDE my house, AND I had no route of escape, AND if I felt that my or my family's life was at risk. Otherwise, use a gun, go to jail for a long time dude! I was amazed when the old guy in Texas got off after killing the 2 burglers running away on the neighbor's lawn. But hey, that's Texas!
ReplyDeleteA firearm is a tool. Like a hammer or a screwdriver. Either can be used the wrong way. A bad plumber goes out of business when they make the wrong decisions and a CCW holder can go to jail for the rest of his life.
ReplyDeleteTraining!!
If I am in fear for my life, I will use my pickup to stop someone from taking it.
Most know the 21 foot rule or whatever for edged weapons. I see people carrying 3 inch pocket knives all of the time "openly".
Who is gonna be mugged or car jacked... a regular dude or a police officer in uniform in a marked vehicle? The bad guys prey like any wild animal, they stalk and size up what they hunt. That was to the people living in la la land, or Canada. Meet force with equal or greater force and my favorite " Hope is not a course of action"
This has gone off point a little from the original posting. If you're legal cool, if they don't like it and are offended where you frequent...I don't know carry a hammer. See what response you get. Why so sensitive. If I see a dude carrying a pistol in the open in a holster that is much less suspicious than a bulge in the shirt or ankle. Or a fixed blade buck knife on their hip, or might I add a box cutter.
They don' run out of ammo.
Cabellas is like walmart anyway, go local.
Did we really need to go into the handicap parking thing? I can see the irony.
War sucks and bad things happen you will never forget, ever. But, it is the job.
What I never could understand [cwp 20 years] is that you have to carry concealed [New York ,hate it here]. If you are carrying a gun openly you have nothing to hide The Police know you are carrying as well as those less well intentioned. Seems to me society is not worried about safety, but whose feelings will be hurt
ReplyDeleteBTW Texas...never mind. I'll save it. That shooting of the rob suspects probably deterred many others and saved the state of Texas from housing them and aspiring criminals for a few years in a overcrowded prison system, and giving them free dental and medical. Man, the Economy.
ReplyDeleteto anonymus from California who can't understand why people would want or need a CWP in a safe place like Utah or Colorado as far as I now there is quite a bit of ganag activity in Colrado. Also parts of Colrado and Utah are not so safe [look in the dicitonary under WILD animals] Could also be just someone who wants to exercse their right to carry. "but really afer all the mass shootngs by the nuts out there someone would have to be incredibly self centered and paranoid to wonder why all the peaceful people shopping around them get nervous and want to leave" I would ask you after all the mass shootings who would not want to Carry? How does carrying a gun make you any less peaceful? btw your statement about the California police says a lot about your state and the people that live there. It seems you are willing to trade Liberty
ReplyDeletefor Safety or you would never allow the police to act that way. Those who would trade Liberty for Safety will soon have neither.
I am a mother of 3 and I am trying to figure out where everyone lives that you feel you "have" to carry a weapon? I for one have huge questions about those that feel they have to carry. If you are that scared in your surroundings then I am going to assume you to be trigger happy and are more of a threat to yourself and others than help. Also, you need to consider when the Right to Bear Arms(Second Amendment) was put into the Constitution(1791)...it was for Military purpose not Americans on a power trip. Because our Military is very progressive today compared to then, one could assume the Constitution to be "outdated" and as Thomas Jefferson had said...every 200 years, we need to have a Revolution and rewrite the Constitution. Times change and so do the needs of our country. Keep your damn guns at home.
ReplyDeleteTo the Mother of three, I am attempting to understand your logic as to how that pertains to this situation, also please let us know which of the other Amendments to the Constituion upset you. Your assumption that we are a trigger happy lot and a danger to ourselves and others would leave me to believe your mind is already made up about a subject you khow nothing about. Speaking of subjects you know nothing about if you think that the right to bear arms has any connection with our military you had better do a little research ie. the federalist papers start with that and get back to me.
ReplyDeleteAustin, This could be a never ending argument. In my state if you have a ccp, you must conceal. You can openly carry without one. Nobody does. When I went to purchase a holster. I told the salesman what I wanted and ask him if I could try the gun for fit. He said sure. Even if a holster has it's applications on the pkg., it still might not be just right for you. I bet you granny is a liberal. They hate that right we have. As for the permit trainers, unless they are police officers too, they have no right to try and tell you what to do. After you get your permit, they don't exist to the holder. Don't knock the $8 guy either, because someone has to do that job just like fast food and retail. If all the $8 jobs were eliminated, you wouldn't like paying $15 for a Big Mac. You can't judge a mans character or heart by the amount of money he makes. Fate may frown on you someday. I am not a lawyer but I think a store can post a sign at the door and prevent you from entering with a gun. I think it's bad business for Cabella's to be like that but let them lose their customers. They don't make a lot of money on people watching the fish. For you in LE, you may be trained in the use of handguns but I bet 99% of you have ever had to shoot someone. Adrenalin changes everything. I've seen shootouts with police and criminals take place at less than 8 or 9 feet and nither find their target, but I bet on the range they could put all in the target at 25 feet. "I'm just sayin."
ReplyDelete"I DON'T CALL 911"
First, CWP starts with "CONCEALED". It doesn't matter what state you're in or what your opinion is. If it's visible, then you are violating some part of "CWP".
ReplyDeleteSecond, CWP and, if you have one, an "Open Carry" law do not supercede "Disturbing the peace." In almost all states that have either CWP or Open Carry, if you show a gun in a busy downtown mall, you are going to get charged with Dist. the Peace. Also, many areas have an ordinance against "brandishing". For instance, you get in an argument with someone and you open your coat to show you're armed. That's a blatant example of "brandishing."
I think you did okay by not challenging "Mr. $8-an-hour" (the use of which makes you sound pretty disparaging), but realize that if you abuse a right, it can quickly be taken away by the folks who are just WAITING for someone to pull a bone-headed stunt like walking through a mall with an AK lookalike, proclaiming "Open Carry".
You should go to Dragon Mans Arms in Colorado. He has signs on his door "DO NOT ENTER WITH A FIRE ARM
ReplyDeleteWE WILL ASSUME YOU INTEND TO ROB THE STORE AND WILL REACT ACCORDINGLY" Let me tell you he is serious.
My comment is "You want respect with your guns, Respect the rights of others on their PRIVATE PROPERTY.
I've shopped at Cabelas for a long time and always found their employees very helpful and courteous, it,s my favorite store to shop. I never carry a gun openly into any sports store with out asking if it' OK. If they have rules about open carry then just deal with it or go someplace else.
ReplyDeleteIn regards to Cabela asking you to leave - Bass Pro has a similar policy at all stores. In fact all persons who are carrying are expected to enter at a designated entrance and have a trigger lock place on the weapon. This is true at the home store in Springfield MO from personal experience. I love my guns but I have no problem with this policy as it avoids a lot of questions. People who frequent Bass Pro are less likely to object but why create a situation when it is unnecessary?
ReplyDeleteYour a NUT, You are one of those that think your above the law and can do what you want, You want everyone to know your carring a gun. It's jerks like you that have laws changed so no one can carry thier guns, Why ruin a good thing, Go get a mental test you need it.
ReplyDeleteI do have a CWP but DON'T live anywhere near these states listed.I love the comfort of having the CWP and the "tool " that goes in tandum with it.There have been too many restaurant killings for me to leave my mess in the car. Hey what about the IDIOT that killed the people in the rest homes. Now where in the world could you be any safer. Especially for the last length of time in your life. I will agree with everyone there are times and places for everything, but I openly wish there had been a citizen such as I at the "Library<---- yes library when my 83 year old aunt was when this scum bag came in and snatched her purse. No this libary was NOT in a bad section of the city. My aunt would NOT have been there if it had been.
ReplyDeleteAs far as the comment" BAN ALL GUNS" sure go for it and while your doing that then call the family of the phsyciatrist that was stabbed muliple times with I believe it was a butcher knife in New York a couple of years ago. Hmmm sounds like we need to ban knives...hey don't forget the forks too they could make a nasty stab wound LOL! So if we ban the butcher knives, than I guess the grocery stores would have to get a special permit to run the butcher shop. Sounds like a GREAT way to stop crimes.
I live in Texas and we don't have an open carry law, only concealed.
ReplyDeleteI'm bothered by people that feel they need to advertise their piece. If I were a "trained" bad guy, I guarantee that disarming some yokel with his pistol on his hip would be my first priority. You present yourself as a target when you flaunt your handgun. Very few armed citizens can protect against someone better trained to take their gun away. BTW, I carry and I also am Krav trained to disarm assailants. Not difficult by any means.
I live in Texas and we don't have an open carry law, only concealed.
ReplyDeleteI'm bothered by people that feel they need to advertise their piece. If I were a "trained" bad guy, I guarantee that disarming some yokel with his pistol on his hip would be my first priority. You present yourself as a target when you flaunt your handgun. Very few armed citizens can protect against someone better trained to take their gun away. BTW, I carry and I also am Krav trained to disarm assailants. Not difficult by any means.
first things first you are missing the point Austin did the right thing, he walked out. who pulled the cord on the liberals? we have heard your misguided ramblings. second to mom of three "I am a mother of 3 and I am trying to figure out where everyone lives that you feel you "have" to carry a weapon? I for one have huge questions about those that feel they have to carry. If you are that scared in your surroundings then I am going to assume you to be trigger happy and are more of a threat to yourself and others than help. Also, you need to consider when the Right to Bear Arms(Second Amendment) was put into the Constitution(1791)...it was for Military purpose not Americans on a power trip. Because our Military is very progressive today compared to then, one could assume the Constitution to be "outdated" and as Thomas Jefferson had said...every 200 years, we need to have a Revolution and rewrite the Constitution. Times change and so do the needs of our country. Keep your damn guns at home."
ReplyDeleteIf you are going to quote then make sure you know some of the other quotes that had been made also like this one.
" For a people who are free, and who mean to remain so, a well organized and armed militia is their best security."
that is what the second amendment is about the right to defend our selves for freedom. Here is another quote.
"Yes, we did produce a near-perfect republic. But will they keep it? Or will they, in the enjoyment of plenty, loose the memory of freedom? Material abundance without character is the path of destruction."
stop eroding our rights and respect our beliefs. we are told to respect yours, which shouldn't happen. Have people forgotten, Do unto others as you would have them do unto you. enough said about that.
As for California that is one of the only states I know of that could shoot with out probable cause. Whatever happened to that, I wonder?
Once again, BOTH sides of the extreme are wrong, but are so vehement that they all fail to see reason. If you walk into a family store, and have an open gun and expect that no one will be scared and no one will have reason to ask you not to bring it in the store is pure selfishness. Yes, I fully agree in gun rights and banning guns thinking that will solve the problem is naive.
ReplyDeleteHowever, to blindly state that no crimes are ever committed by someone that "legally" owns a gun is also just as naive as the person that thinking a gun ban will bring utopia.
In Pittsburgh we had several officers that were gunned down by a man that "legally" owned guns. Yes, technically he had the right to own them, but should there not be some sort of reason used?
However, now the big thing is "Well, if we just would ban guns.." The thing is, he was out of is mind. He had planned to kill them because he mistrusted the government (sadly much like the posts here). He would have killed them regardless. He would have used knives, his fists, whatever. So, clearly a gun ban will not bring us to a perfect world. On the other hand, neither will turning a blind eye to the death and harm that guns DO cause. Yes, you are an honorable citizen. Some are not. There have been shootings, bombings...brutal mass killings in public places. Is it that important that you carry your gun with you 24/7 that you are willing to sacrifice the security of others? Yes, you were trustworthy. Yes, your gun was "legal." But would it have been so bad to have the others shopping there with their families feel more at ease for the mere minutes it took you to shop? Again, I am not saying you shouldn't be able to carry your gun nor am I saying you shouldn't own a gun. I am merely saying to realize the other side of things. Only when both sides of the extreme actually stop spitting fire at each other, will there truly be a solution.
This issue requires thought and sensitivity.
Ever heard of a little thing called 'private property'? Open carry laws do not pertain to private property. Doesn't matter what kind of permit you have, if you're in my house I have the right to set the rules. Business establishments work the same way. They are NOT public places, they are private property with public access.
ReplyDeleteI have a cwp, am x military, and a disabled vet. By the way I was disabled in combat. not just because I ran for 20 years and my body hurts....I am hopeful that I or my wife will never have to pull our weapons from thier place of concealment. It is just so nice knowing we have the option in the freak instance we need to. In the 20 mins. that it will take any emergency personel to activate and arrive. My family could be raped or murdered by some meth starved addict. Furthermore I assure you I have hit my target with enough adrenaline to make a horse blackout flowing my veins. By the way this is annonymous and only myself and my wife know about our weapons. Not bragging here but maybe some would be criminal is reading this and realizes now that it maynot be the smartest move he/she has ever made, knowing that all around him/her there could be any number of us just enjoying our day out with our family and reaady to protect them or you from immenent bodily danger at a moments notice. I love people who Carry. Open or concealed. Seeing a cop off duty carring makes me feel at east when I am out and about with my wife and kids, beacuse I know he/she will have my back if something bad were to happen.
ReplyDeleteSorry about the mis-spelling It is entirely to early for this.
ReplyDeleteI'm a newbie to owning a gun, so maybe my opinion will be disqualified by some of the "vets" that have commented, but it's all good--we've all been newbies at one point or another.
ReplyDeleteHere's the deal, you have people from all walks of life converging upon a public location like Cabela's. Just because something isn't unlawful doesn't always mean it should be instituted or taken advantage of in a public arena.
We have our freedoms and rights, and God bless 'em. With this in mind, we should also be mindful of everyone else. I think you handled it well by not making a scene. We need to make sure, however, that we respect all other freedoms, such as the right a publicly traded company has to limit firearms on their premises. Remember, if one freedom imposes upon another freedom, it's no longer freedom.
Austin, I read your story, and the comments posted from many others. Candidly, I have to agree with the 50 or so people that replied. So you went into the store with your sidearm strapped on, you got asked to leave, which you did, and then you posted negatively about the store, the number of parking spots and and spoke down about the Security guard and his employer in general. Was there anything else about the Cabellas experience that bothered you? Every Cabellas I have been in has a sign on the door that says no firearms or deadly weapons. I can't think your store would be different. Also, during your CWP training they should have advised you of private property owners rights, meaning the security guard that you talk down about was simply doing his job when he politely asked you to remove your weapon from the store, or if you wanted to, he would secure it for you...And why is the amount of his hourly pay such an issue? Would you have felt better if the store manager came over and asked you the same? As for the number of handicaped parking spots, don't blame Cabellas or the property developer, they probably didn't want them either. Instead,go talk to your local city or town council. But then they are just following the requirements of The Americans with Disabilities (ADA) a federal law that requires business to have a specific number of handicapped parking spaces based upon the square footage of the store. I hope you have a great Memorial Day. and if you have a minute, say a prayer for those brave men and women that have paid the ultimate sacrifice for your freedoms.
ReplyDelete"I carry a gun, because they don't make a holster big enough to carry cops."
ReplyDeleteThat statement is freakin' aweseome...you just came up with a new redneck t-shirt. I am going to make one now online.
Austin, I will make you a deal. You give me back the full use of my leg and the life of my bud that was in the other side of the hooch when the mortar round hit,and I will return my Purple Heart and not park in the handicap zones anymore.
ReplyDeleteOh yes. I carry because a cop is too heavy and won't fit in my purse.
This guy sounds like he has a chip on his shoulder. He makes the law biding carriers look bad!
ReplyDeleteI am a 70 year old Redneck Woman. I've my ccp for two years. I had emailed my (I thought) best friend of the steps I was going through to get it. When I drove 6 hours to visit her, I took my pistol out of my pocket, muzzle to the floor, then stuck it back in. Nothing was said until I was going to see her a year later and she informed me there would be no guns in her house. Told her I wouldn't be back, since I would be as welcome as a rattlesnake at a picnic. Thus ended a 40 year friendship.Funny thing is, I feel no loss!!! Don't let anyone trample on your second amendment rights!!
ReplyDeleteAaron from Arizona here,
ReplyDeleteLiberal, Conservative, Left, Right...Please check your partisanship at the door.
I'm just about the most "Liberal" guy around (the correct word is Progressive, btw) and I believe that except for k-12 schools, courts etc. we should be allowed, in this country as it currently is, to carry, preferably concealed.
Approximately 25 percent of all "shooting sprees" were forcefully ended by fellow citizens who carried. I'd like to thank those responsible neighbors for their courage and abilities. Someone standing in line next to you with a gun, whether you see it or not, likely has his AND your best interests in mind. I feel your aprehention, it's very understandable and logical when all you know about crime is what you hear on the fear-mongering evening news, fear really does sell, it sells so well.
A stranger is just a friend you haven't met yet, so a stranger wearing a gun is an enemy you haven't met yet? Those who commit crimes don't "wear" their guns, they "take" their guns.
So, thanks to my fellow citizens, for going through training, learning how to safely handle whatever self-defense tool you prefer, whether it be firearm, edge, cains/walking stick or whatever, reality can bite sometimes, you should be able to bite back in defense of yourself and others.
WHEN SECONDS COUNT, POLICE ARE ONLY MINUTES AWAY.
ReplyDeleteIf you have a permit to carry concealed then keep it concealed, no problem!
ReplyDeleteAccidents with not covering it up happen all the time. This is the result!
The store guy was just doing his job and yes may have been a little rammy but it didn't sound like it.
Sounds like you could have been upset by not finding what you were looking for right away.
I too am a retired police officer and I am no gun expert and don't and never did want to be.
The gun is just an important tool we carry.
Wow so many opinions. Wonder if any conversations such as this one could occur in, oh say, Russiia or Iran? Probably not. Our Constitution is the only document that validates our citizenship. We would otherwise be subjects.
ReplyDeleteThe Bill of Rights was Included to ensure that INDIVIDUALS would have rights. This is not some screenplay script that is rewritten because you don't like a scene. Without the collective bill, you have no rights. Leave the constitution alone and go fight your 200 year revolution somewhere else.
Many of you seem to be missing the point. You are exercising a constitutional right to carry. I celebrate that. What you are not considering is, and put yourself in the store owners shoes on this one,by being issued a CCW permit you accept liability for your actions. The store owner has that same right. If by being issued CCW stopped all accidents from happening, then by all means every person needs one. I don't believe that is the case. Just because a person has a permit to carry does not mean the automatically are exempt from every making a mistake. The $8/hr guy doesn't have xray vision to see that your mag. is empty and nothing in the chamber. Locally we had our first shooting range death since 1938. I'm sure that guy didn't mean to do that either. As a store owner they have a right to protect themselves from some yahoo that thought his open carry weapon was empty. Can you imagine the case that would make for an attorney just aching to take gun rights away. You have your rights but so does the store owner. He has his reasons, you should respect that. A weapon in the holster isn't going to jump out and kill someone but many an open carry have been involved in accidents because someone thought it was empty and everyone of them never meant for that to happen and they would tell anyone that asked they never dreamed they could have caused that type of accident. Just because you have a permit doesn't mean I trust you to handle your weapon as safely as I see fit. I have the right on my property to ask you to put it away. When you use the entire constitution not just a portion you will see we all have rights. I respect yours you need to respect mine. I also believe in gun rights.
ReplyDeleteWe have 2nd Amendment rights to carry firearms openly. The stockholders/management of Cabellas have a right to prevent the exercise of our 2nd Amendment rights while we are shopping in their store. End of story.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
ReplyDeleteIf there are states where open carry is common, then it would make sense, only in those states, to require someone who wants to carry concealed to show good reason why he doesn't want to carry openly. Except for those few people who might have a real reason to not carry openly (and who have obtained a permit to carry concealed) it should be illegal to carry a weapon concealed because those who carry concealed should be considered to be up to do good. That is the only excuse I can think of for the government, local state or federal, to have anything at all to say abouut who carries what weapons or where. If there are buildings whose owners don't want anyone with guns in them, they can post a conspicious notice to that effect at each entrance and people who don't want to go into killing zones can stay out. In any place where such postings are not conspicious, it should be illegal for anyone to tell you to leave unless you are waving a weapon about in a threating manner or pointing it at someone (like most gun counter sales personell do almost every day).
ReplyDeleteI think anyone who feels like they have to carry a gun on their hip or concealed around town is mighty insecure and a downright sissy.
ReplyDeleteThe guy was just doing his jobat Cabelas keeping nutcases like you out of the store.
c-mon guys man up and stop being wooses hiding behind a pea shooter...get real!!!
Anonymous Anonymous said...
ReplyDeleteI think anyone who feels like they have to carry a gun on their hip or concealed around town is mighty insecure and a downright sissy.
The guy was just doing his jobat Cabelas keeping nutcases like you out of the store.
c-mon guys man up and stop being wooses hiding behind a pea shooter...get real!!!
August 19, 2009 8:05 PM
Anonymous Anonymous said...
It does not sound like you were bullied or mistreated by the security officer at all. Grow up move on and put your big girl panties on!!!!
August 20, 2009 3:15 PM
Wow, these last 2 pussy posters need to have their asses kicked by someone. You two morons are the nutcases wearing panties.
Stop being idiots and learn how to spell.
ReplyDeleteEx-Alaskan, now Arizonan here. And Im confused by reading all of this. And i did read ALL of it. First off it confused me that Cabellas would want you to conceal your weapon, or take it outside. In more common sense places, the liability of the store is mitigated by making it a policy that NO firearms are permitted in the store/mall/restraunt/etc regardless of concealment or otherwise. To suggest that by merely concealing it mitigates the stores liability in an "accident" is ludicrous! So yes, this confused me. Another thing that confused me is people chiming in about "open carry" laws. Every state has an open carry law. Its called the 2nd amendment. Now I dont live or have never lived in these so called "progressive" states that require you to have say some key, or lock, or limited number of rounds in a magazine, or only be able to carry ammunition between the hours of 10 am and 3pm, or whatever ridiculous limitations you voters have allowed to be imposed in your states, but it just boggles my mind that there would be laws that if you had a CCW you would HAVE to use it, and not carry openly, or that there are people that think that carrying openly makes you more of a threat than someone that has a CCW. Its a piece of paper people. It doesnt make someone safer. I personally dont care one way if someone carries concealed or openly. As one poster stated earlier, its the guy walking into the store with the weapon in his hand that would get the long stares and looks and most likely shot. And on the matter of our Constitution as a whole, and not to sound like a doom and gloom kind of guy, those of you talking about rights and freedom are completely disillusioned. We dont have any rights in this country. We have privileges. Rights cannot be taken from you, but privileges can. Just ask the Japanese-American citizens of 1938-1942 what rights we have. Or the Iraqi-American citizens of 2002-2008. Regardless of any of this, bravo to the original poster for handling it like a man, and using his pen rather than his sword!
ReplyDeleteWhat kind of bike does your brother have?
ReplyDeletei dont think it s alegal or non legal issue but fact of the matter is what if it were someone and they allowed people to carrie ther gun in a public place such cabellas and one of your family memeber s was in there and some one went postal would you feel the same about bringing your gun in a store that you drove 20 miles for well i walk that much when i deer hunt
ReplyDeleteI feel I need to comment on the handicap parking thing. I shop at Cabellas ALL the time and need those parking spots since I have 2 children in wheelchairs. They come everywhere with me and therefore folks who need those parking spots do shop at Cabellas. FYI, there are more folks with handicap tags that shop in those kinds of stores then you know.
ReplyDeleteWhen I am not breaking a law or am not being one of those idiots that just want to be seen, I will not be told that I have to do something else to please someone elses idea of what the law is!
ReplyDeleteThere are a lot of people that are trying to push new ideas out there about handgun laws and even some pushing different thinking about our rifles too. It just gets a little outrageous that just because you have a gun you have to pussyfoot around so many people and that only their opinion matters when this happens, I would completely stay away from that and all other cabellas myself. There are too many stores online that will sell the items to you that you want and usually at a better price!!!!!
Open carry, concealed carry, what's the difference really? Mall shootings? Yep, heard of two and seen a couple of homicides right up close and personal. Know what the difference is between open carry and a mall shooting?
ReplyDeleteIn case nobody has pointed it out, mall shootings happen when dirtbags have a gun in their hand. Concealed carry has nothing to do with it, nor does concealed carry.
Some people have it all figured out. Gun = Crime. A bit too simplistic for any but a child's mind. But argue with anyone who has it all figured out and you'll find that you're the child. You're an idiot, and you don't care that people get shot.
I do care. I care that I could get shot, or someone else will and I won't be able to do squat to stop it. That's what I care about.
Right now I am someplace where they don't require a permit to carry concealed at all. I guess they figure criminals being criminals, they don't bother about things like laws anyway. So leave law abiding people to heck alone to do their best against the scum.
Hello. And Bye.
ReplyDelete